“Who are you becoming?”
— Rich Roll
At age 40, Rich Roll (@richroll) made the decision to overhaul the sedentary throes of overweight middle age. Walking away from a career in law, he reinvented himself as a globally recognized ultra-distance endurance athlete, bestselling author, and host of the wildly popular Rich Roll Podcast, one of the world’s most listened to podcasts, with more than 200 million downloads.
Named one of the “25 Fittest Men in the World” by Men’s Fitness and the “Guru of Reinvention” by Outside magazine, Rich shares his inspirational story of addiction, redemption, and athletic prowess in his bestselling memoir, Finding Ultra, and in the cookbooks/lifestyle guides The Plantpower Way and The Plantpower Way: Italia, which he co-authored with his wife Julie Piatt.
Rich is a graduate of Stanford University (where he was a member of their dynastic, multiple-NCAA-championship men’s swimming program) and Cornell Law School. He has been featured on CNN and on the cover of Outside and has been profiled in The New York Times, Forbes, ESPN, and many other prominent media outlets.
Please enjoy!
Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Overcast, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Stitcher, Castbox, Google Podcasts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. You can watch the interview on YouTube here.
Brought to you by Athletic Greens all-in-one nutritional supplement, Eight Sleep’s Pod Pro Cover sleeping solution for dynamic cooling and heating, and Tonal smart home gym. More on all three below.
The transcript of this episode can be found here. Transcripts of all episodes can be found here.
This episode is brought to you by AG1! I get asked all the time, “If you could use only one supplement, what would it be?” My answer is usually AG1, my all-in-one nutritional insurance. I recommended it in The 4-Hour Body in 2010 and did not get paid to do so. Right now, get a FREE Welcome Kit, including Vitamin D3+K2 and AG1 Flavor Sampler, when you first subscribe. Visit DrinkAG1.com/Tim to claim this special offer today and receive your 1-year supply of Vitamin D—a vital nutrient for a strong immune system and strong bones!
This episode is brought to you by Eight Sleep. Temperature is one of the main causes of poor sleep, and heat is my personal nemesis. But a few years ago, I started using the Pod Cover, and it has transformed my sleep. Eight Sleep has launched their newest generation of the Pod: Pod 5 Ultra. It cools, it heats, and now it elevates, automatically. With the best temperature performance to date, Pod 5 Ultra ensures you and your partner stay cool in the heat and cozy warm in the cold. And now, listeners of The Tim Ferriss Show can get $350 off of the Pod 5 Ultra for a limited time! Click here to claim this deal and unlock your full potential through optimal sleep.
This episode is brought to you by Tonal! Tonal is the world’s most intelligent home gym and personal trainer. It is precision engineered and designed to be the most advanced strength studio on the market today. Try Tonal, the world’s smartest home gym, for 30 days in your home, and if you don’t love it, you can return it for a full refund.
What was your favorite quote or lesson from this episode? Please let me know in the comments.
SCROLL BELOW FOR LINKS AND SHOW NOTES…
Want to hear another episode that outlines effective paradigms for dealing with trauma and addiction? Listen to my conversation with Dr. Gabor Maté, in which we discuss investigating the causes rather than the consequences of addiction, the therapeutic value of psychedelics (including the right way and the wrong way to experience ayahuasca), why some powerful modalities aren’t for everyone, and much more.
SELECTED LINKS FROM THE EPISODE
- Connect with Rich Roll:
Website | Twitter | Facebook | Instagram | YouTube
- The Rich Roll Podcast
- Finding Ultra, Revised and Updated Edition: Rejecting Middle Age, Becoming One of the World’s Fittest Men, and Discovering Myself by Rich Roll | Amazon
- The Plantpower Way: Whole Food Plant-Based Recipes and Guidance for The Whole Family: A Cookbook by Rich Roll and Julie Piatt | Amazon
- The Plantpower Way: Italia: Delicious Vegan Recipes from the Italian Countryside: A Cookbook by Rich Roll and Julie Piatt | Amazon
- “Watch Your Kite Soar.” | Rich Roll, Twitter
- Rich Roll Is the Guru of Reinvention | Outside Online
- Stanford University
- National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA)
- Lower Companions | THIS24
- Leaving Las Vegas | Prime Video
- Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP
- Long-Term DUI Consequences | BACtrack
- Alcoholics Anonymous
- Inception | Prime Video
- How Addiction Stunts Emotional Growth and Development | Boardwalk Recovery
- The Twelve Steps | Alcoholics Anonymous
- A Look at Step 10 of AA’s 12-Step Program | Verywell Mind
- My Name Is Bill W. | Prime Video
- A New Pair of Glasses by Charles A. Chamberlain | Amazon
- Blockchain: What You Need to Know | Investopedia
- What Is Addiction? These Experts Say It’s Not Black and White | Well+Good
- Mood Follows Action: A Minimalist Approach To Mental Health | Mostly Mindful
- 13 Effects of Fast Food on the Body | Healthline
- Dale Carnegie Training
- The 4-Hour Workweek: Escape 9-5, Live Anywhere, and Join the New Rich by Tim Ferriss | Amazon
- Strong for Vegetables | Stanford magazine
- 10 Uncommon “Superfoods” from the World of Ultra-Endurance by Rich Roll | The Blog of Author Tim Ferriss
- How to Say “No” Gracefully and Uncommit | The Tim Ferriss Show #328
- Ironman
- Triathlon | Wikipedia
- Training Zones Explained | ACTIVE
- AMA #19: Deep Dive on Zone 2 Training, Magnesium Supplementation, and How to Engage with Your Doctor | The Drive #145
- Dr. Peter Attia on Longevity Drugs, Alzheimer’s Disease, and the 3 Most Important Levers to Pull | The Tim Ferriss Show #517
- Why I Sleep In A Tent | Rich Roll
- Mountain Lion | National Wildlife Federation
- Gravity Blankets | Amazon
- Mindfold Sleeping Mask | Amazon
- Rick Rubin on Cultivating World-Class Artists (Jay-Z, Johnny Cash, etc.), Losing 100+ Pounds, and Breaking Down The Complex | The Tim Ferriss Show #76
- See Total Solar Eclipse Over Antarctica | CNN
- Voicing Change | Rich Roll
- Effortless: Make It Easier to Do What Matters Most by Greg McKeown | Amazon
- Essentialism: The Disciplined Pursuit of Less by Greg McKeown | Amazon
SHOW NOTES
- Prior to turning things around at age 40, what role had alcohol played in Rich’s life, and when did he realize it was a problem? How bad did it get? [07:27]
- Why did Rich decide to pursue a career in law? [16:09]
- What was the last straw that made Rich decide to seek help for his addiction to alcohol? How old was he, what was going on in his life at the time, and what form did this help take? [18:26]
- What does Rich notice people commonly missing when he retells his story of addiction recovery and lifestyle changes that led him to become the person he is today? [27:45]
- As Dr. Gabor Maté says: “Don’t ask why the addiction, ask why the pain.” What tools have most helped Rich understand and manage his own addiction? [33:51]
- Was the decentralized nature of Bill Wilson’s Alcoholics Anonymous basically blockchain before blockchain was cool? [40:45]
- Rich says that addiction is “a spectrum so broad that almost anybody can find themselves somewhere along the line.” Even if you might not consider yourself an addict, the tools of addiction recovery can often be used to help you break bad patterns you find yourself repeating. [43:45]
- Having trouble cultivating good habits (like regular exercise)? Remember: “Mood follows action.” [48:36]
- Why (and how) did Rich turn his physical health around at age 40? [50:52]
- Rich’s most worthwhile investment of time, money, or energy. [57:59]
- Rich’s advice for anyone trying to make positive changes in their own life — whether it’s building a small, beneficial habit, picking up a new set of skills, or overhauling their physical regimen for maximum results. [1:03:55]
- Zone 2 training thoughts, experiences, and recommendations. [1:14:59]
- How — and why — did Rich get in the habit of regularly sleeping in a tent on his roof? How does he maximize benefits and alleviate potential dangers of this unorthodox practice? [1:24:34]
- By not scheduling commitments before noon, what does Rich’s daily architecture look like? How often does he succeed in fending off disruptions to this schedule? [1:32:00]
- How Rich got to the point where he commits to living a month off the grid every year, what he does to ensure that it happens, and how he benefits from this practice. [1:38:37]
- An aside: Rich asks me to share what I experienced off the grid recently in Antarctica. [1:42:41]
- What would Rich’s billboard say? [1:49:49]
- What is Rich most excited about for the year ahead? [1:52:32]
- What Rich would ask the audience to consider and parting thoughts. [1:56:51]
MORE RICH ROLL QUOTES FROM THE INTERVIEW
“Addiction lives on this incredibly broad spectrum. And it’s a spectrum so broad that almost anybody can find themselves somewhere along the line.”
— Rich Roll
“Compulsion to want to know all the answers and how it’s going to play out and all the steps you’re going to need to take to get there can prevent us from moving forward in our lives.”
— Rich Roll
“You have to live your life if you’re going to have anything worthy to say about the human experience.”
— Rich Roll
“My original thought was, ‘Who are you?’ But I’ve modified that. I think a better question is, ‘Who are you becoming?’”
— Rich Roll
“Every decision that we make, every interaction that we have, every word that comes out of our mouth is either moving us towards a better, more authentic version of ourselves or away from it.”
— Rich Roll
“My whole life has been premised on this idea that if I haven’t suffered to create this thing, that I haven’t worked hard enough, or that it doesn’t hold value. And I’m in this journey of trying to let go.”
— Rich Roll
Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Overcast, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Stitcher, Castbox, Google Podcasts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. You can watch the interview on YouTube here.
Comment Rules: Remember what Fonzie was like? Cool. That's how we're gonna be — cool. Critical is fine, but if you're rude, we'll delete your stuff. Please do not put your URL in the comment text and please use your PERSONAL name or initials and not your business name, as the latter comes off like spam. Have fun and thanks for adding to the conversation! (Thanks to Brian Oberkirch for the inspiration.)
Tim, In reference to books on the history of AA check out Pass It On- Bill Wilson and the AA message. Its a bit of a jerk off session in the early pages since it hovers on Bill as a child for the first part, but when it starts to get into the way AA came to be and how it formed it is very informative. Also, not sure how factual it is but it is fairly widely accepted that our group actually derived from the Oxford Groups- a christian organization from back in the day. A lot of the tools they used are used in the 12 step format. Thanks for consistently reminding me to always remain a student.
Tim- you HAVE to interview Yvon Chouinard. He is light years ahead on business and time management. He was doing everything you all are talking about 40 years ago.
After about a decade of listening and following Tim Tim this is my first comment on your blog. Thank you to you and your team that does a great job. This conversation was special and important. I hope I can come around one day and tell you that it is the four hour work week that changed my life as well. Here’s to a happy, peaceful and wonderful year ahead! 🥂🍻
I have enjoyed learning about Zone 2 training on your podcast, and I am wondering which gender the research has primarily been done on and if this training should be replicated exactly for women? It seems most of your podcast guests providing info on physical training are men, and most research has been on men, and as a woman, particularly one in my mid-40’s, my metabolism and hormones dramatically impact how my body responds (or doesn’t) to particular types of exercise, in ways differing from men. Would you consider a female trainer as a guest? Dr Stacy Sims comes to mind but I imagine there are others addressing this gender difference directly.
I wonder how this man accomplishes so much with 4 kids? I would love to hear a deep dive about this, but I understand that Tim’s curiosity probably doesn’t extend to family work-life balance. My husband is super curious as well, as he is a very dedicated father.
Thank you, Tim and Rich! I really like this message from Rich: "… But when I think about what we do, having these long form conversations, it just feels to me like there’s never been a better opportunity to contribute in a positive way. And I just want to encourage people to find a way to transcend the predominant media narrative that seems hell bent on pitting us against each other, and to be more conscious about not just your media choices, but how you carry that sensibility into the world, and the manner in which you interact with other people…" How do you guys think that you can better filter the information we receive daily to organize our opinion as learners and listeners, being critical in a good way?
Thank you, Tim and Rich! I really like this message from Rich: “… But when I think about what we do, having these long form conversations, it just feels to me like there’s never been a better opportunity to contribute in a positive way. And I just want to encourage people to find a way to transcend the predominant media narrative that seems hell bent on pitting us against each other, and to be more conscious about not just your media choices, but how you carry that sensibility into the world, and the manner in which you interact with other people…” How do you guys think that you can better filter the information we receive daily to organize our opinion as learners and listeners, being critical in a good way?
Great listen! A few books on AA history-AA comes of Age – a brief history of A.A. by Bill Wilson, Not God: A history of Alcoholics Anonymous by Ernst Kurtz and AA’s Twelve Steps and 12 Traditions. The 12 Traditions are a set of principles that are guidelines for members, the groups,and the AA society as a whole. They are brilliant. Also, is PBS documentary called. Bill W. The Creative Force Behind Alcoholics Anonymous. You can visit aa.org, for more information. I hope this is helpful.
I picked up the 4-hour Work Week in 2007 on a layover in LaGuardia and have followed you since. In Rich's words, I've sincerely enjoyed watching you move towards a better and more authentic version of yourself. You and your guests have pulled me along a trajectory of growth to such an extent that its safe to say I can't comprehend my life without the doors of exploration that you've opened. I've read Letters from a Stoic, devoured all of Michael Pollan's books (and started my own garden … no poppies), took a #vanlife trip around Europe at the urging of Mr.MM, annoy my wife with whatever data Peter Attia happens to fixated on and, more recently, have become plant-based partially influenced by Rich Roll and his story. Thank you for this conversation and for your work. I look forward to what's next.
HAVE to interview Yvon Chouinard. He is light years ahead on business and time management. He was doing everything you all are talking about 40 years ago.
I got hooked on podcasts when Rich started the RRP. I remember those early days when Rich had just come back from Maui living in a yurt I believe. I have good memories of listening to those early episodes and been blown away by all the amazing people Rich was having on the show. Rich congratulations on doing the hard work and accomplishing everything you've done to transform your life. Tim – perhaps you can poll your audience on what athletic goal you should give yourself for 2022. It could be doing a rim to rim trip in the Grand Canyon, an acroyoga peak pose like standing extended Hand to Hand or some other cool feat that your audience might suggest.
Hi, Tonya – Thanks for your comment. You might also enjoy Tim's interviews with Dr. Stefi Cohen https://tim-blog-development.mystagingwebsite.com/2021/01/06/stefi-cohen/ and Amelia Boone https://tim-blog-development.mystagingwebsite.com/2015/12/22/amelia-boone/. Best, Team Tim Ferriss
My favorite quote from Rich: "None of us are static. In every moment, we are shifting and we are changing. And every decision that we make, every interaction that we have, every word that comes out of our mouth is either moving us towards a better, more authentic version of ourselves or away from it…"
Your comment made me laugh, Patrick! ("annoy my wife with whatever data Peter Attia…" Yup. Guilty!!). Thanks for that!!